Forum Thermomix
Thermomix Recipes for TM5 and TM31 => Bread => Topic started by: achookwoman on March 30, 2012, 02:34:21 am
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This recipe is based on the book, "Bread Revolution" by Duncan Glendinning and Patrick Ryan. The dough is mixed in the TMX for 4 minutes, poured into the lined tin and left on the kitchen bench for 3 to 4 hours and then refrigerated over night. The following morning, it is left for 1 hour to come back to room temperature and then baked in a preheated oven for 50 mins. The bread tin used was 27 x 10 x 10 cm.
bread tin used was 27 x 10 x 10 cm.
500g. bread flour, (I used Laucke Bread Mix which has sugar and salt added).
2 teaspoon of salt and sugar.
400g of sourdough starter. ( consistency of pancake batter )
250g warm filtered water.
Knead all in TMX for 4 mins.
Pour into lined bread tin.
Stand on bench for 3 to 4 hours. Covered with plastic.
Refrigerate overnight.
Bring back to room temp.( About 1 hour.)
Bake in preheated oven 200 o C. with water in dish on floor of oven
Bake for 50 mins,or until cooked. turning tin 1/2 way through..
Cook on wire rack.
Posted by elizabeth at 6:15 PM
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I'd love the crusts off that lovely looking loaf Chookie ;D
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That looks so gooooood chookie! ;D
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Chookie your bread is so inspiring. I can make a good loaf but not a great one like this.
Judy can we share the crust :)
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Would it be ok to refrigerate any kind of bread dough overnight ??
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Would it be ok to refrigerate any kind of bread dough overnight ??
tan , yes. make sure it has risen a bit before you put it in the fridge, cover with plastic, and let it come back to room temp before baking. It will rise a bit in the fridge and again a little more when it is coming back to room temp. You should also get a bit of 'oven spring' when baking.
Judy and Dede, the crust was really something on this loaf.
This recipe is a bit different to what i usually make. If anyone with a sourdough starter is interested i will post the recipe.
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Boo hoo. I went to use my starter the other day and after about 2 or 3 years it had gone mouldy. I don' t know why, it may have been contaminated with the water I used. I will either go and visit yoke, or make sme from the beginning.
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Cookie, that is awful. We get very attached to our starter. What did it look like and did it smell different.?
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My starter was a rye one so it was brown. The colour was much the same, the smell was ok too but it actually had mould growing over about 1/3 of it. I was quite upset as I had had no previous problems and it wasn't stale. I might see if VHJ has some or as I said go over to Yoke's. It's not far. She is actually offering some TMX sourdough classes that I might try and get to.
I will have to be more careful with it.
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Cookie, Before I chucked it out, I think I would have poured off any liquid, scraped out all but a tablespoon , put this in a clean jar,and fed it again. If it grew mould again then I would give up on it. That it smelt OK suggests that it was probably still alright underneath. If you can't get any fresh starter I could try posting you some. Mine is white, not rye.
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Yes would LOVE some sour dough recipes! I currently make a no knead bucket bread which is quick for during the week but I would like to experiment a bit more. Your loaf looks awesome and puts mine to shame and I don't know if i will be able to believe my husband next time he raves about it :p
I have read that mould on a starter is not the end of the starter and to do what was suggested above - apparently in most cases if you can get some unmouldy stuff out you can recover it. Unless its yellow or pink mould then its time to start again. I have never had to try though.
*fades off into a day dream about yummy sour dough bread*
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ETC, This recipe is different in that the amount of starter is nearly as much as the flour, and yet it doesn't have a heavy sour flavor. What it does, is make for a really crisp and crunchy crust. I will post the recipe for you. I will put it up the top with the original comment.
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Yum that looks so lovely and crusty Chookie :)
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I truly despair about having Coeliac disease when I see how gorgeous that kind of loaf looks. I usually don't miss not being able to eat wheat based bread but when I see a photo like that, it makes me drool! Alas!
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I can understand that Merlin - I couldn't imagine not being able to eat normal bread.
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Merlin, sorry about that. Have you tried the gluten free one that I adapted from Dan Lepard's recipe ?
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Actually, I did and it was lovely, thanks! That was around the time of all the kerfuffle with Dan's publisher, remember??? I forgot to post my thanks as I wasn't sure of the political correctness of posts during that time regarding Dan's recipes.
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Chookie, I would love the recipe for this bread as I have sourdough starter. Have you posted it?
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Visitors last night, will try and do it today. New recipe also coming for pumpkin pie without sugar.
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Kazza, have posted recipe. Have fun.
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Thank you Chookie :-*
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I have a sourdough starter (bought from Yoke) and I would like to have a go at making this loaf. Can I do it as a free-form loaf instead of in a tin? Would the method be the same? This will be my first attempt at making a sourdough loaf!
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Karen, as the dough is pretty slack it would spread. If I wanted a free form I would use a cake tin and remove the base, sit it on a lined baking tray. This will prevent the dough spreading too much. When it has doubled, remove the cake ring, or leave it on. Up to you.
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Thanks ACW - I fossicked around in my boxes of spare cake tins, and actually found a bread tin almost exactly the same size as the one you used - so I will use that instead. Thanks for the advice! Cant wait to have the bread for lunch tomorrow .......
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Let us know how it goes KarenH. Is it a rye starter?
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Let us know how it goes KarenH. Is it a rye starter?
Karen, not sure how it will go with a rye starter, but give it a go. let us know how you go. If you want bread for lunch, take the loaf out very early in the morning, so it has time to reach room temp and then double.
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Yes, it is a rye starter ............. and I am confused now. Can't I use a rye starter for this recipe? I really dont know ANYTHING about sourdough. I asked in the organic shop (when I bought the rye flour to feed the starter) if I had to make rye bread with a rye starter, and they told me I could use a rye starter to make any kind of sourdough bread.
I have not started this recipe yet, and my starter has been out on the bench for 2 days and is lovely and bubbly and active ........ is there a better recipe that I should be making instead of this one?
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Yes, it is a rye starter ............. and I am confused now. Can't I use a rye starter for this recipe? I really dont know ANYTHING about sourdough. I asked in the organic shop (when I bought the rye flour to feed the starter) if I had to make rye bread with a rye starter, and they told me I could use a rye starter to make any kind of sourdough bread.
I have not started this recipe yet, and my starter has been out on the bench for 2 days and is lovely and bubbly and active ........ is there a better recipe that I should be making instead of this one?
Try this recipe first as it is very simple. It is just that I have never used a rye starter. I will be posting more recipes that I know will work, later.
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OK - here goes ;D
This was my starter before I started making the bread - last fed this morning. I made a mistake in estimating how much starter I had - I could only use 300g starter to leave enough to feed up to make more ..... so I used 300g starter and added an extra 50g warm water. Hoping it will work, because my starter was pretty thick to start off with.
(http://i1057.photobucket.com/albums/t391/kheath1409/ryestarter.jpg)
And this is what the dough looked like just after I put it into the tin. It is now sitting on the kitchen bench until I go to bed ......
(http://i1057.photobucket.com/albums/t391/kheath1409/sourdough.jpg)
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Good luck with it Karen, can't wait to hear about the end result.
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Come up for lunch tomorrow JD, and you can taste it for yourself :D
My parents are visiting from WA for a few days, so I have taken the opportunity to cook some different things for them ...... planning to do soup for lunch tomorrow to go with a lovely, fresh, crusty sourdough loaf. If the bread fails, there is always Bakers Delight ;D
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If you lived around the corner I'd certainly pop in to see that loaf Karen. You go girl and show your parents how clever you are in your new kitchen.
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Karen, looks REAL good to me. Spray the top with some water and cover with a shower cap or plastic. Look for a double rise, (not the time), before you bake it. Probably wont get much oven bounce. Have you a warm spot where you can sit it in the morning.?
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ACW - thanks SO much for your help and encouragement :-* I can programme my oven to 38 degrees ...... I was thinking of popping it in there to rise in the morning. Still pretty cold here in the Adelaide Hills - bit like where you are probably. I will post more photos as it progresses
Have a wonderful weekend away
Karen
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Karen your starter looks lovely. I've made all sorts of bread using Yoke's rye starters.
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I am having a few problems with my loaf this morning .... here is a pictorial journey ;)
After letting the dough rise for 4 hours, this it what it looked like before putting in the fridge
(http://i1057.photobucket.com/albums/t391/kheath1409/beforebed.jpg)
This morning the dough had risen and overflowed in the fridge. It was almost like the gladwrap on the top had stopped it rising upwards, and it had spread out sideways and overflowed the tin into the fridge. the gladwrap was placed loosely over the dough, not stuck down tight.
(http://i1057.photobucket.com/albums/t391/kheath1409/thismorning.jpg)
And the dough was all sticky on the glad wrap.
(http://i1057.photobucket.com/albums/t391/kheath1409/sticky.jpg)
I scraped as much dough as I could off the plastic, misted the loaf with water, misted more gladwrap with water too, laid it gently over the bread and put it in the oven at 35 degrees to rise.
(http://i1057.photobucket.com/albums/t391/kheath1409/risinginoven.jpg)
The dough still looks really flat though, and with the soft, slack texture of the dough and the gladwrap on the top, I cant see how it is going to rise up into a nice looking loaf like Chookies (beginning of this thread).
I am not quite sure now when to start baking this loaf, because I read in Yokes book that it is not good to over-prove the dough because the bread will go really hard.
Any suggestions?
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sorry i cant help you Karen, i would still bake it
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Wow, Karen, The rye starter is a lot stronger than the white one. Love the photos. Uni is right bake it, after about 1/2 an hour in warm oven. If you baked directly from the fridge it would be cooked on the outside but uncooked in the middle. I have a photo similar to yours.
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Well, I baked it, and it smells good, but it looks pretty flat :(
(http://i1057.photobucket.com/albums/t391/kheath1409/loaf.jpg)
(http://i1057.photobucket.com/albums/t391/kheath1409/finishedloaf.jpg)
Back to the drawing board I think .......
JD - lucky you arent coming up for lunch today - I dont think this loaf is worth travelling the distance ;D :o
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Let's hope you slice it and it has turned out OK Karen, despite the fact it doesn't look like a loaf of bread ;)
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Actually, I was most surprised - it tasted really good, and had a lovely texture inside, despite as JD says, it doesnt look like a loaf of bread! 4 adults and 2 little kids almost polished off the whole loaf for lunch, and everyone liked it. Well, at least there is plenty of improvement in the aesthetics of the loaf :D
(http://i1057.photobucket.com/albums/t391/kheath1409/slicedbread.jpg)
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KatenH, looks OK. Flat top often happens when over proved.
Looking at your photos again, you probably could have cooked it last night.
If it were mine, I would probably make it with 1/2 the starter. I or if you liked the taste, don't do the over night, just put into tin, bake when doubled.
PS. This sort of bread is delicious toasted.
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This is a great recipe, thanks Chookie.
I thought I'd killed my starter, but after 6 days of feeding it came good just as I was about to bin it. the resulting loaf is lovely - I'm thrilled.
I'd show you a pic, but I can't work out how to do it.
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ok, I hate defeat, I've started two new Sourdough starters again today, Its good to hear Amanda that yours finally came good maybe I should have keep on with the last two. Chookie is sending me some of hers so I will have three going, one has got to work..
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Amanda, I am so pleased for you. It is a bit of a challenge, but when it comes good it is a real buzz. Keep feeding it and making loaves and it will develop a better flavour.
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AB, I had 4 starters going over the weekend. Ended up combining 2 as I had bread everywhere. The interesting one was in the jar I had scraped out. I was about to wash the jar out, when I thought I would test to see how a tiny bit of starter would go. Added water and flour and within a couple of hours , had a jar full of starter.
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Chookie as you are in Victoria too, do you keep your starters in a warm place, I have put them outside in the sun but will bring them in when it gets cold. Seeing as you can keep them in the fridge I'm confused as to whether they do need heat.
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AB, I'm certainly no expert on this - wait until Chookie (who does, in fact, live in Victoria) and / or JD come on, they will know better. Getting back to me not being an expert - my understanding is that you keep it warm whilst you are feeding and 'growing' it, then when you have the quantity you want, you pop it into the fridge, which keeps it alive (viable?) until you need it again then you take it out of the fridge, bring it up to room temperature and go for it! Hope I am right about that.
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Thanks Marina, that is my understanding too I was just checking, I would like to just leave it outside for three days but i think it is too cold.
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Yes Marina is correct. You can do the whole process inside if you wish. Warmth and food are what it likes best. If it is cold,(out of the fridge, it will still grow, but very slow) In the fridge it hibernates, (like a bear, Ha) Like yeast bread, it likes 20/25 o best. Likes to be stired, so when you add flour and water, give it a good stir.
AB, posting your starter tomorrow.
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Thanks Chookie looking forward to receiving it it is only about 11 degrees here might go and bring the babies in.
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Thanks Chookie looking forward to receiving it it is only about 11 degrees here might go and bring the babies in.
Yes, far too cold for them. Put them by the fire.
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AB, I'm certainly no expert on this - wait until Chookie (who does, in fact, live in Victoria) and / or JD come on, they will know better.
Marina, I am certainly no expert in bread making. Some questions I know the answers to but mostly I have no idea and have to do a lot of reading again myself to find the answer (or I pm Chookie who must get sick of me asking stupid questions ;D)
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Judy, never sick of answering questions about bread making. Just want everyone to enjoy making a good loaf. I think you know more than you realize. ;D
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You are too kind Chookie. You certainly have everyone enjoying their bread making experience - what would we do without you :-*
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I used to only make bread in the bread maker until we started all these bread making topics. The bread from the TMX is much nicer, lighter and its not a silly square high tin.
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In cold places you could perhaps you sit the starter on a heated brewing pad?
http://www.allthingsbrewing.com/beer-brewing-equipment/heating/heater-pads (http://www.allthingsbrewing.com/beer-brewing-equipment/heating/heater-pads)
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Oh Consumerate I'm not that dedicated if these don't work I will wait until summer to do it again, Chookie is sending me some of hers so hopefully I will be on my way with that.
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How hot does it get? Could place a cake rack over it and stand the starter on this. Or a dehydrater on 50 o .
As long as you can get it warm during the day, it will start to work.
Years ago when I started making yoghurt, I would wrap it in a baby blanket and place it on our hot water unit over night. As long as you leave it at room temperature it should be fine.
I think of a tale I read in an English Mag. about a family snowed in . The dad thought he would make bread with the kids to entertain them and give them some bread to eat. They mixed and kneaded and them left it to rise, but nothing happened. At the end of the day, dad through it in the bin, Next morning when he went to put something in the bin, there was a lovely loaf of risen dough.
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I'm not a big bread eater. I just like 1-2 slices of a loaf but get a huge thrill out of watching a loaf grow. When i make a loaf i could look at in wonder and talk about how gorgeous it looks whilst its a full loaf. I would love to try the sourdough but am a little hesitant about feeding obligations.
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Chookie, my loaf that I made with rye starter on Sunday looked just like Karen's. The dough was very sticky. I used a mix of 300g bakers flour, 100g white spelt, 100g wholemeal spelt. Do you think I should reduce starter to 200g as you suggested before, or do you think because I used 200g spelt that there was not enough gluten?
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CP give it a go, or I can give you some starter. It is truly easy. If it 'goes to heaven' you can start again.
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Ok cookie, you can give me a starter at the next get together :-*
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I like your story about the snowed-in family Chookie, brings back fond family memories:
Shortly after my Mom & Dad were married they moved to a small town in the backend of beyond where there was no shop to buy bread - you had to make your own. She followed the recipe in her cookbook but the two loaves she made just wouldn't rise. So in desperation she buried the dough in the garden and borrowed a loaf from Tannie Coetzee next door. That evening she guiltily accepted Dad's praises on her great loaf. Early in the morning Dad went to the loo (outside loo in those days) and came back chuckling about the two huge "mushrooms" that had grown overnight in the garden :o (one very embarrassed young wife! :-[). Tannie Coetzee showed Mom how it's done and since then she produced great loaves every time. Still makes me smile :D.
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Rogizola, love this story.
CP, give it a go.
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On Friday I spent a lovely afternoon visiting Judy and her DH, catching up and chatting about everything. I was lucky to come away with a jar of starter that Judy had grew from Chookie's starter.
I made my first sour dough this weekend using this recipe and I didn't do a very good job. I think my dough was far to wet. My dough didn't rise at all yesterday in the hours before I placed it in the fridge. I left it for a few hours today before baking it, it did rise a bit but not much. The result was a more crumpet like texture than bread.
I'll try again next weekend, perhaps with one of the other sour dough recipes Chookie has posted.
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Katie, have another go. As I have said to DD, it usually takes 3/4 goes to get it right. If it was easy, everyone would be making it and it wouldn't cost $6 a loaf. You will get it right.
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I promise you we will get you there Katie - my first few efforts looked like yours too and sourdough seems so complicated. It will still be like the blind leading the blind even though I finally made a successful loaf this week - believe me there were many unsuccessful attempts although having said that, I didn't realise it until I made a much better one :D
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Great post :) anyone have any tips for applying this fridge method when using yeast rather than a starter? And spelt flour?
Cheers,
B
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Hi Chookie I am so glad you are online. I am doing my very first sour dough loaf after reading all the information and nurturing my starter for two weeks. I am doing this method you have here as I want my loaf tomorrow. I have just poured into the pan, it was rather like cake batter consistency is that right????? Thanks
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Yes, GHM, it can look like that. Will probably cook with a flat top. Leave it out of the fridge until you go to bed to try and get it moving. In the morning put it in the warmest spot you can find. Don't cook it until it doubles. Good luck.
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my sour dough has been on then bench all day and has not risen at all, shall I put it in the fridge overnight or just leave it out?
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i hope u left it out GHM
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Sounds like it has used up ll it's energy. Tip it out of the tin and put it in the TMX and knead in enough flour to make a stiffer more bread like dough. Probably needs another 100g of flour to get it going. May have to add aLITTLE water. Put back in tin, spray with water, cover, leave on bench to double.
Or turn mixture into pancakes.
Let us know
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i hope u left it out GHM
Oops, it was getting late, I put in fridge it is now in a warm place. Will try to put back in TMX to redo! I presume I leave to come back to room temp before I do that Chookie?
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i hope u left it out GHM
Oops, it was getting late, I put in fridge it is now in a warm place. Will try to put back in TMX to redo! I presume I leave to come back to room temp before I do that Chookie?
Yes. TReat it like a baby. Keep it warm and well fed and it will grow.
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Sounds like it has used up ll it's energy. Tip it out of the tin and put it in the TMX and knead in enough flour to make a stiffer more bread like dough. Probably needs another 100g of flour to get it going. May have to add aLITTLE water. Put back in tin, spray with water, cover, leave on bench to double.
Or turn mixture into pancakes.
Let us know
I put back into TMx and added flour
, it turned into a sticky dough with the consistency of bubble gum, still didn't rise!! Was very difficult to clean up the bowl. This one beat me, GHM 0 sour dough 1 ......but, I'll be back! Just didn't have any more time to spend on making another again today. Maybe my starter wasn't quite mature enough.
a question, now my starter is a baby again ( there is about 1/2 cup remaining) do I feed with tablespoon od flour and water or can I go half a cup of each???
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GHM, There is something wrong here. Chuck the lot and start again. I will post you some starter if you like. let me know.
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GHM, There is something wrong here. Chuck the lot and start again. I will post you some starter if you like. let me know.
Hi Chookie, thanks for your kind offer, I will give it another go once my baby starter has grown again. If I still cant get it right I will let you know.
Thanks again for all you advice and spreading all your sourdough love :))
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GHM, no problem. My pleasure.
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If I was home I would have given you some GHM. I'm sure it will work this time.
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I have made this successfully a couple of times now. It has been so cold overnight that I just left it on my bench all night and baked it first thing in the morning. Thanks Chookie.
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06/20/1c98252da9743df659b6d66bfb984423.jpg)
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It looks yummy. I can just taste it.
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ES that does look good. Love the holes where the butter can sink in.
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Taking advantage of our hot weather yesterday I decided to make a Sour Dough Loaf using this method of Chookie's.Well what a laugh I had.After leaving it for the 3 hours as started in the method it started overflow.I couldn't rest it overnight in the fridge..I had to cook it there and then.So on went the oven at 8pm to cook it.I was rewarded with a fabulous loaf.
(http://i950.photobucket.com/albums/ad348/Cornish_cream/4699486db2ceedfd05e4a3408ec5c96d.jpg)
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This looks great, but I have a question about the starter. You use 400g of starter? Do you always keep that amount of starter on the go? Or do you build it up over a day or two?
I make a sourdough loaf a couple of times a week. I know I don't use very correct methods, so sometimes the loaf doesn't rise too well, but it usually does...
(I keep my starter (probably about 300g) in a spring top jar in the fridge. I put about 120-150g into thermomix with about 350g flour, some salt, and enough water to make a middlingly soft dough (2.5 minutes of kneading). Then I put that in a mixing bowl with a shower cap on it overnight on the counter. In the morning, I use wet hand to fold dough over 4 times and flop it into a round cake tin lined with a floured paper cake liner. When it's risen 'a bit', I turn on oven with a Le Creuset pot in it for 30 minutes. When it's heated up, I carefully lift the loaf in its paper thing into the Le Creuset, put lid on and bake for 30 minutes, then for another 15 minutes with lid off.
I feed the starter to replace the volume I took out, and put it back in the fridge. Sometimes, I feed it extra to later make to crumpets or flatbreads or stuff)
My issue is that I would love the loaves to get a bit more 'oven shock', as I love that torn crust look. Should I be building up a bigger starter, and then use more in each loaf?
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It's good to see you put the heat wave to good use Denise, is that your best sour dour loaf ever? It certainly looks good.
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CC, I had to laugh. I had the same problem when I put the overnight dough to rise in the lounge room where the fire was going. You managed a great result. Congratulations.
AnneUK. I don't think that there is any perfect method and yours sounds pretty good to me. I mostly don't get oven spring but a little rise when in the oven. I try to prove it to max in tin before I place it in the oven. I think the cracking on the top is due to a higher proportion of water in the dough.
If I could make a suggestion. With the overnight rise, do it in a lined bowl which is about the same size as the pot that you are heating in the oven. ( don't do a second rise). Lift the dough carefully from the bowl after overnight rise and carefully place it, liner and all, into heated pot and bake.
You could add more water to the mix as you are not going to knead it by hand. I give my dough 4 minutes in the TMX.
Hope this helps.
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Denise what an awesome SD loaf.
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Thanks girls :-*
It's good to see you put the heat wave to good use Denise, is that your best sour dour loaf ever? It certainly looks good.
The best loaf to date Judy. :)
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AnneUK. I don't think that there is any perfect method and yours sounds pretty good to me. I mostly don't get oven spring but a little rise when in the oven. I try to prove it to max in tin before I place it in the oven. I think the cracking on the top is due to a higher proportion of water in the dough.
If I could make a suggestion. With the overnight rise, do it in a lined bowl which is about the same size as the pot that you are heating in the oven. ( don't do a second rise). Lift the dough carefully from the bowl after overnight rise and carefully place it, liner and all, into heated pot and bake.
You could add more water to the mix as you are not going to knead it by hand. I give my dough 4 minutes in the TMX.
Hope this helps.
That's a good suggestion. I just had it in my head that I needed to do it in 2 stages... Will have a go tonight.
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Wow, that's an impressive loaf
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That loaf is quite impressive. Must get my mitts on a starter, DH loves sourdough